Am Montag, 16. Februar 2009 15:13 schrieben Sie:

So I have an application that I am developing. The UI module includes the following:

import Graphics.UI.Gtk import Graphics.Rendering.Cairo import Graphics.Rendering.Cairo.SVG import Graphics.UI.Gtk.Gdk.EventM

Can you tell from that list if i am likely to be able to rewrite it to use Grapefruit?

No, this won’t work at the moment. As I already said, Grapefruit’s widget support is very restricted at the moment. (And if I say “very” I really mean it.) So Grapefruit is worlds apart from what the catch-all Graphics.UI.Gtk import provides. And there is no graphics support at the moment, so there is nothing equivalent to the Cairo interface. Coming up with a sensible purely-functional, toolkit-independent, reactive graphics interface will also need some design work. Until now, I concentrated on getting Grapefruit’s core well. This includes a scalable FRP implementation, a record system (since you don’t want to provide an input signal for every attribute of every single widget in practice) and support for writing/extending Grapefruit UI backends without writing lots of boilerplate code. Providing a wide variety of ready-to-use widgets, graphics primitives, etc. is future work which, hopefully, I can delegate largely to interested third parties. ;-) Best wishes, Wolfgang

Am Montag, 16. Februar 2009 16:55 schrieben Sie:

I would actually quite like to integrate Hieroglyph with Grapefruit, which would give you your Cairo support and give me a sensible way to implement events outside of my really rather broken model.

This sounds really interesting. Do you already have some concrete ideas? The important thing for Grapefruit integration would be to provide signals of pictures (i.e., time-varying pictures) instead of just static pictures. In the classic Grapefruit version, we have a graphics package which defines a special graphic signal type. For the current version, I’d prefer to use Grapefruit’s standard signal types, applied to an ordinary picture type (type of static pictures). This would mean a more composable solution (Grapefruit does time-dependence and interaction and Hieroglyph does graphics). However, there are situations where it cannot be ignored in Hieroglyph that pictures can be modified. I think of compound pictures and of lists. These should be updated incrementally but this wouldn’t work with ordinary lists etc. Grapefruit is expected to have support for incremental list signals soon. By the way, I like your multi-backend approach (Cairo and OpenGL). If Hieroglyph should act as the standard graphics library to use with Grapefruit, I would very much like if Hieroglyph’s interface would be designed as backend-independent as possible. For example, there is also 2D graphics support in Qt. In my opinion, this would be worth supporting for use in Qt-based applications. What are your plans concerning Hieroglyph backends? Best wishes, Wolfgang

2009/2/16 Gour

Do you anticipate that Grapefruit will be capable for writing real-world GUI apps quit soon?

LOL. Funny typo. If the apps quit soon we're in trouble! :-)

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"Peter" == Peter Verswyvelen writes:

Peter> LOL. Funny typo. If the apps quit soon we're in trouble! :-) Well, let's do some LOL-ing on my own account... Sincerely, Gour -- Gour | Zagreb, Croatia | GPG key: C6E7162D ----------------------------------------------------------------

Am Montag, 16. Februar 2009 16:43 schrieb Peter Verswyvelen:

2009/2/16 Gour

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Do you anticipate that Grapefruit will be capable for writing real-world GUI apps quit soon?

LOL. Funny typo. If the apps quit soon we're in trouble! :-)

I’m sure that current Grapefruit applications will be quitted soon by their users. :-D Best wishes, Wolfgang

Am Montag, 16. Februar 2009 17:46 schrieb Wolfgang Jeltsch:

Am Montag, 16. Februar 2009 16:27 schrieb Gour:

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Do you anticipate that Grapefruit will be capable for writing real-world GUI apps quit soon?

I have no concrete anticipation. It depends very much on the community. If there is notable interest and this interest makes people hacking on Grapefruit then it might not take so long until you can write real-world apps in Grapefruit.

By the way, are there people out there who would like to hack on Grapefruit during the Utrecht Hackathon [1]? Best wishes, Wolfgang