July 2008 - HOpenGL - Haskell.org

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Fw: patch applied (ghc): Remove the OpenGL familyof libraries fromextralibs
by Andy Gill 23 Aug '08

23 Aug '08

Conal, myself, and a few others are working on FieldTrip http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/FieldTrip A library that is built onto of OpenGL. Early days, but we certainly use OpenGL. Technically, the final version will be independent of OpenGL, but use OpenGL for rendering. But that a critical piece of the library offering! Andy On Jul 25, 2008, at 4:13 PM, Don Stewart wrote: > claus.reinke: >> But neither do I believe the rumour that OpenGL isn't much >> used, and forwarding the removal notice gives those users the >> opportunity to speak up now if they prefer no gaps in OpenGL >> presence, or forever to hold their peace, as they say. > > I for one have noticed this library *is* actively used. Many of the > fun > new games that have appeared are using it, in particular. > > Such as: > > http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/frag > http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/ > Monadius > http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/ > roguestar-gl > http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/rsagl > http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/Shu- > thing > http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/topkata > > The tutorial was also translated to the wiki last week, > > http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/Opengl > > It's a good, reliable package, in active use, widely ported. > > -- Don > _______________________________________________ > Haskell-Cafe mailing list > Haskell-Cafe(a)haskell.org > http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe

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Fw: patch applied (ghc): Remove the OpenGL family of libraries fromextralibs
by Claus Reinke 28 Jul '08

28 Jul '08

FYI: Haskell's OpenGL binding has just been dropped from GHC's extralibs, which means that it will no longer be kept in sync with GHC development, at least not by GHC HQ. GHC HQ has its hands full and -generally speaking - extralibs are to be replaced by H(L)P, the Haskell (Library) Platform: http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/Haskell_Platform so this part is understandable. But OpenGL has been dropped before H(L)P is ready to take over from extralibs, and at the recent GHC Irc meeting on the topic http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/attachment/wiki/IRC_Meetings/ghc-2008-0… the mood seemed to favour not including OpenGL&co in the initial versions of H(L)P. Sven put a lot of good work into these libraries, but he is often not around for a long time, and it would be a shame if these gems were orphaned and went out of sync in the meantime. While I haven't used OpenGL in a while, I've always hoped to come back to that, not to mention Sven's spatial audio binding additions. And if I'm not mistaken, there are other community members who are using these libs right now for research, possibly even prototyping in connection with a startup? So, if one of you wanted to step forward and offer to keep these Haskell bindings for OpenGL&co maintained, perhaps steward them into the H(L)P, now would probably be a good time. Just thought I'd forward this, for those not following cvs-ghc, Claus ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Lynagh" <igloo(a)earth.li> To: <cvs-ghc(a)haskell.org> Sent: Friday, July 25, 2008 12:11 AM Subject: patch applied (ghc): Remove the OpenGL family of libraries fromextralibs > Thu Jul 24 03:27:36 PDT 2008 Ian Lynagh <igloo(a)earth.li> > * Remove the OpenGL family of libraries from extralibs > > M ./libraries/Makefile -4 > M ./libraries/extra-packages -4 > > View patch online: > http://darcs.haskell.org/ghc/_darcs/patches/20080724102736-3fd76-f5601cb7a2… > > _______________________________________________ > Cvs-ghc mailing list > Cvs-ghc(a)haskell.org > http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/cvs-ghc

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Re: [Haskell-cafe] Fw: patch applied (ghc): Remove the OpenGL familyof libraries fromextralibs
by Jefferson Heard 28 Jul '08

28 Jul '08

Yes, same here; don't worry, it's not going away. It would be nice to know, though, how many people are using it and what they're using it for. I'm using it for information visualization, and slowly evolving/cribbing together something like the Processing (http://www.processing.org) framework for Haskell as I do more things. On Sat, Jul 26, 2008 at 5:46 AM, Alberto Ruiz <aruiz(a)um.es> wrote: > Don Stewart wrote: >> >> claus.reinke: >>> >>> But neither do I believe the rumour that OpenGL isn't much >>> used, and forwarding the removal notice gives those users the >>> opportunity to speak up now if they prefer no gaps in OpenGL presence, or >>> forever to hold their peace, as they say. >> >> I for one have noticed this library *is* actively used. Many of the fun >> new games that have appeared are using it, in particular. >> >> Such as: >> >> http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/frag >> http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/Monadius >> http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/roguestar-gl >> http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/rsagl >> http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/Shu-thing >> http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/topkata >> >> The tutorial was also translated to the wiki last week, >> >> http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/Opengl >> >> It's a good, reliable package, in active use, widely ported. > > I'd just like to say that HOpenGL is essential for me. It is one of the > reasons why I finally decided to use Haskell for all my work... > > Alberto > _______________________________________________ > Haskell-Cafe mailing list > Haskell-Cafe(a)haskell.org > http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe > -- I try to take things like a crow; war and chaos don't always ruin a picnic, they just mean you have to be careful what you swallow. -- Jessica Edwards

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Re: [Haskell-cafe] Fw: patch applied (ghc): Remove the OpenGL familyof libraries fromextralibs
by Claus Reinke 26 Jul '08

26 Jul '08

>> So, if one of you wanted to step forward and offer to keep these >> Haskell bindings for OpenGL&co maintained, perhaps steward them >> into the H(L)P, now would probably be a good time. >> >> Just thought I'd forward this, for those not following cvs-ghc, >> Claus > > Note the OpenGL are still just as maintained as they used to be -- that > is, it hasn't had a maintainer for several years. Some people post the funniest rumours as if they were facts. $ ghc-pkg field OpenGL maintainer maintainer: sven.panne(a)aedion.de At the end of this message, I also append the output of darcs changes since OpenGL 2.1 was supported, for those interested in what might be involved in maintainance: Fri Nov 10 10:14:54 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne(a)aedion.de * Updated Haddock module headers (now OpenGL 2.1 support, API is stable) It just so happens that the library is very stable (unlike other libraries I could think of;-) - Sven's last bug-fix patch was in March 2007, the patches since then have been build system evolution/maintainance. So the problem is not with the library, but with the environment - since its creation, the library has seen FFI tools appear and disappear, FFI spec and library hierarchy take shape, darcs appear and be taken on, Cabal appear and be taken on, packages and tools move on, split up, change their API, etc. - thanks to Sven and others, the binding has weathered all that, without making a lot of noise. And now, there is another enviroment change, with extralibs going and the Haskell Platform aiming to improve the Haskell installation experience. And new quality criteria will be prescribed that this old library will have to meet to be allowed in with the new kids on the block. > The only change is that the GHC developers don't put them in a tarball > on haskell.org/ghc prior to releasing GHC itself. It isn't the tarballing, it is (a) whether the library is run in the HEAD buildbots to flush out breaking changes to the environment early (b) whether enviroment changes are reflected in the library to unbreak its build before user installations are affected (c) whether the library can be relied on as being available on default Haskell installations (this would seem to be less of a problem with Cabal/hackage and user installs, but not all clients have install privileges/tools - OpenGL building uses configure, which in itself might not be installed on Windows; and in some University contexts, installation for public PCs is on a centralised, yearly basis, not per student; etc.; adding the GLUT dll has been a popular request ever since GHC had Windows installers, meaning that every single time someone forgets to put that dll in the installer, someone has reported it as a bug/feature request) I'm not aware of any urgent breakage in the OpenGL binding, nor is the current source going away, and as Duncan says, he expects OpenGL to reappear in the Haskell Platform later on. But neither do I believe the rumour that OpenGL isn't much used, and forwarding the removal notice gives those users the opportunity to speak up now if they prefer no gaps in OpenGL presence, or forever to hold their peace, as they say. Unless Sven wants to do the job himself, a maintainer would mainly have to adapt the library to the Haskell Platform criteria, keep up with the forever changing build environments, and counter rumours about the OpenGL binding being unmaintained or unused. Claus $ darcs changes --from-patch=stable Thu Jun 19 13:43:50 GMT Daylight Time 2008 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> tagged GHC 6.8.3 release Fri Jun 6 00:56:57 GMT Daylight Time 2008 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> tagged 2008-06-06 Sat Nov 10 01:11:04 GMT Standard Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> tagged GHC 6.8.1 release Sat Nov 10 01:09:54 GMT Standard Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> tagged 2.2.1.1 release Sat Oct 27 13:48:05 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> * Bump version number Thu Oct 18 18:31:37 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Duncan Coutts <duncan><haskell.org> * Specify build-type: Configure Mon Jun 4 12:59:36 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ross Paterson <ross><soi.city.ac.uk> * --configure-option and --ghc-option are now provided by Cabal Thu May 24 15:56:14 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> * Remove Makefile and package.conf.in (used in the old GHC build system) Thu May 17 10:49:12 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Simon Marlow <simonmar><microsoft.com> * add includes: field Mon Apr 30 12:17:32 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> * Make configure fail if the package cannot be built Sat Apr 28 20:58:51 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> tagged GHC 6.6.1 release Sat Apr 28 20:56:55 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> tagged 2.2.1 release Tue Apr 24 12:39:29 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> tagged GHC 6.6.1 release Tue Apr 24 12:38:31 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> tagged Version 2.2.1 Sun Apr 22 20:50:57 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> * Bump version to 2.2.1 Wed Apr 18 13:13:30 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> * Follow Cabal changes in Setup.*hs Wed Apr 11 02:22:21 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> * Fix -Wall warnings Sat Apr 7 18:41:16 GMT Daylight Time 2007 Ian Lynagh <igloo><earth.li> * Make Setup.hs suitable for building in a GHC tree Tue Mar 13 17:46:09 GMT Standard Time 2007 sven.panne><aedion.de * Importing hs_OpenGL_getProcAddres must use ccall instead of CALLCONV Patch provided by shelarcy><gmail.com Sun Feb 18 11:02:00 GMT Standard Time 2007 Ross Paterson <ross><soi.city.ac.uk> * README about building from darcs Mon Jan 1 12:50:21 GMT Standard Time 2007 sven.panne><aedion.de * Note that we support OpenGL 2.1 now Thu Nov 30 13:39:51 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Completed implementation of drawBuffers Thu Nov 30 13:24:01 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Made drawBuffers a full-blown StateVar (getter not yet implemented) Thu Nov 30 13:21:35 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Refactored (un)marshalling of modelview indices, fixing an off-by-two bug on the way Thu Nov 30 12:39:56 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Changed the type of a few implementation limits to GLsizei for consistency reasons Wed Nov 29 12:54:02 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Added current raster secondary color query Wed Nov 29 12:17:05 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Added sRGB textures Wed Nov 29 09:30:54 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Added pixel buffer objects Wed Nov 22 13:01:06 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Made 'uniform' a 'StateVar' to allow queries, too Wed Nov 22 12:36:56 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Added missing Storable instance for FogCoord1 Tue Nov 21 12:02:00 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Added vertexProgramTwoSide and vertexProgramPointSize Wed Nov 15 15:19:08 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Do not return trailing NUL in shader string queries Sun Nov 12 14:04:30 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Make Eq/Ord/Show/ObjectName superclasses of Shader Sun Nov 12 13:12:25 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Added utility function 'majorMinor' to easily parse OpenGL's version strings Fri Nov 10 13:19:51 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Extended the set of possible types for vertex attributes and uniform variables Fri Nov 10 12:26:48 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Distributed shader-related stuff to the right modules Fri Nov 10 10:14:54 GMT Standard Time 2006 sven.panne><aedion.de * Updated Haddock module headers (now OpenGL 2.1 support, API is stable)

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Re: [Haskell-cafe] Fw: patch applied (ghc): Remove the OpenGL family of libraries fromextralibs
by Jefferson Heard 26 Jul '08

26 Jul '08

Well, since HOpenGL seems to support practically all of OpenGL 2.1, I don't see that there's much to maintain, except compatibility with upcoming releases of GHC and possibly some optimization. Maybe I'm missing something, though. Is there a list of outstanding bugs somewhere? I personally know of one bug that I found some time ago, which I simply worked around, but a comprehensive list, I'm not aware of. -- Jeff On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 1:27 PM, Don Stewart <dons(a)galois.com> wrote: > claus.reinke: >> FYI: Haskell's OpenGL binding has just been dropped from GHC's >> extralibs, which means that it will no longer be kept in sync with GHC >> development, at least not by GHC HQ. >> >> GHC HQ has its hands full and -generally speaking - extralibs are to >> be replaced by H(L)P, the Haskell (Library) Platform: >> >> http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/Haskell_Platform >> >> so this part is understandable. But OpenGL has been dropped before >> H(L)P is ready to take over from extralibs, and at the recent GHC Irc >> meeting on the topic >> >> http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/attachment/wiki/IRC_Meetings/ghc-2008-0… >> >> the mood seemed to favour not including OpenGL&co in the initial >> versions of H(L)P. Sven put a lot of good work into these libraries, >> but he is often not around for a long time, and it would be a shame >> if these gems were orphaned and went out of sync in the meantime. >> >> While I haven't used OpenGL in a while, I've always hoped to come >> back to that, not to mention Sven's spatial audio binding additions. >> And if I'm not mistaken, there are other community members who >> are using these libs right now for research, possibly even prototyping >> in connection with a startup? >> >> So, if one of you wanted to step forward and offer to keep these >> Haskell bindings for OpenGL&co maintained, perhaps steward them >> into the H(L)P, now would probably be a good time. >> >> Just thought I'd forward this, for those not following cvs-ghc, >> Claus > > Note the OpenGL are still just as maintained as they used to be -- that > is, it hasn't had a maintainer for several years. > > The only change is that the GHC developers don't put them in a tarball > on haskell.org/ghc prior to releasing GHC itself. > > -- Don > _______________________________________________ > Haskell-Cafe mailing list > Haskell-Cafe(a)haskell.org > http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe > -- I try to take things like a crow; war and chaos don't always ruin a picnic, they just mean you have to be careful what you swallow. -- Jessica Edwards

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